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The Brooks Robinson Tournament--Second Round Continued

September 24, 2010

September 24, 2010

 

            We’ll start by doing the tournament overview, which we probably should have been doing all along.   There are now 28 players left in the tournament; after today there will be 24.

 

Baltimore

Brooks Robinson (1) against

Doug DeCinces (8)

September 26

Jimmy Dykes (2) against

Billy Nash (7)

September 25

Toby Harrah (3) against

Harlond Clift (6)

Today

Jimmy Collins (5) has advanced

-----

------

 

 

Cleveland

Graig Nettles (1) against

Ken Keltner (9)

September 26

Ron Santo (2) against

Willie Jones (7)

September 25

Sal Bando (3) against

Travis Fryman (6)

Today

Bob Elliott (4) has advanced

-----

------

 

St. Louis

Gary Gaetti (1) against

Edgardo Alfonzo (9)

September 25

Chipper Jones (2) against

Harry Steinfeldt (7)

September 26

Todd Zeile (3) against

Don Money (6)

Today

Scott Rolen (5) has advanced

-----

------

 

 

Los Angeles

Buddy Bell (1) against

Mike Lowell (9)

Today

Tim Wallach (2) against

Adrian Beltre (7)

September 25

Ron Cey (3) against

Willie Kamm (6)

September 26

Carney Lansford (4) has advanced

-----

------

 

 

 

Bando 62, Fryman 61

            Sal Bando overcame a 14-5 deficit in hitting for average with plate discipline and team success, and edged past Travis Fryman into the third round, 62-61.

 

 

Bando

Fryman

Power

10

10

Speed

4

4

Hitting For Average

5

14

Plate Discipline

11

5

Career Length

9

7

Defense

9

11

Awards

8

8

Team Success

6

2

Total

62

61

 

 

            Fryman out-hit Bando .274 to .254, and, while some of this was a difference in their eras, some of it wasn’t; the norm for a third baseman in Bando’s era was .254, in Fryman’s, .263.   Bando, however, walked as many as 118 times a year, giving him a .352 to .336 edge in on base percentage and an 11 to 5 advantage in plate discipline, although Fryman also walked as many as 77 times in a season.   The advantage in plate discipline gave Bando a 30-29 edge at halftime, and the two men played even over the second half. 

            Travis Fryman was a good defensive third baseman who drove in 90+ runs seven times.   That’s a good player.

 

Travis Fryman—Won and Lost Contributions

YEAR

Team

Age

HR

RBI

AVG

SLG

OBA

OPS

BW

BL

FW

FL

Won

Lost

WPct

Value

1990

Det

21

9

27

.297

.470

.348

.818

7

3

1

1

8

4

.657

10

1991

Det

22

21

91

.259

.447

.309

.756

11

13

3

5

14

18

.441

12

1992

Det

23

20

96

.266

.416

.316

.731

15

14

4

4

19

18

.507

19

1993

Det

24

22

97

.300

.486

.379

.865

19

6

2

4

22

10

.683

27

1994

Det

25

18

85

.263

.474

.326

.801

10

10

2

2

12

13

.491

12

1995

Det

26

15

81

.275

.409

.347

.756

11

13

6

0

17

14

.555

19

1996

Det

27

22

100

.268

.437

.329

.766

12

15

3

1

15

16

.476

14

1997

Det

28

22

102

.274

.440

.326

.766

13

13

5

1

18

14

.554

20

1998

Cle

29

28

96

.287

.504

.340

.845

12

11

4

2

16

13

.556

18

1999

Cle

30

10

48

.255

.410

.309

.719

5

10

2

1

7

11

.375

4

2000

Cle

31

22

106

.321

.516

.392

.908

17

7

4

2

20

9

.705

26

2001

Cle

32

3

38

.263

.335

.327

.662

5

9

1

3

6

12

.334

3

2002

Cle

33

11

55

.217

.350

.292

.642

5

13

2

3

7

16

.304

2

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

223

1022

.274

.443

.336

.779

142

137

39

32

181

168

.518

187

 

 

Zeile 58, Money 56 (OT)

            A contest of Zeal vs. Money sounds like a moral debate, doesn’t it?   It was actually Zeile vs. Money, and Zeile won it in overtime, 58-56.

 

Zeile

Money

Power

12

7

Speed

1

6

Hitting For Average

12

7

Plate Discipline

10

5

Career Length

10

6

Defense

7

11

Awards

1

12

Team Success

5

2

Total

58

56

 

            As I explained earlier, what is actually meant by “overtime” here is that the player who wins the contest by Win Shares and Loss Shares did not win it by the recessive analysis, which is Category Rankings.   By Category Rankings Money would have beaten Zeile handily, 261 to 219.

            Someday, after Dick Allen is elected to the Hall of Fame, Don Money will be the answer to a trivia question:  Who played third base for the Phillies between Dick Allen and Mike Schmidt?   Allen came up as a third baseman, and played third for the Phillies from 1964 to 1967, although his defense at third base was erratic.  In ’68 the Phillies third baseman was Tony Taylor, who was an older player who had lost his second base job to Cookie Rojas, and then late in ’68 Money came up.  Money played shortstop in ’69, moved to third base in ’70, and moved to Milwaukee when the Phillies brought up Mike Schmidt. 

            Another trivia question;  How many players can you name who held the same record in both leagues?   I know of three:

  • Mike Marshall held the record for Games Pitched in both leagues, and I believe still does (90 in the American League, 106 in the National).
  • Bill Buckner at one time held the record for assists by a first baseman in both leagues (161, National League, 1983, and 184, American League, 1985.   In fact, at one time Buckner ranked one and two in both leagues.  He has since been beaten in the National League by Mark Grace.)
  • Don Money at one time held the record for fewest errors in a season at third base (150 or more games)—10 in the National League (1972), 5 in the American (1974).  

            To be honest, it is very unclear—totally unclear—who was actually a better player, Money or Zeile.   Money has a higher “Batting” Winning Percentage, and he has a higher “Fielding” Winning Percentage.    Zeile had a substantially longer career.  Suppose that you compare two players:  Player A has a won-lost record of 100-100; Player B has a won-lost record of 110-120.    They are the same, except that B has 10 more wins, 20 more losses.   Is 10-20 a “positive’ contribution or a negative one?

            It depends on what you think the replacement level is.   If you think the replacement level is .200, then 10-20 is a small positive, since the player is better than his replacement would be.   If you think the replacement level is .400, then “A” is better than “B”.   Since replacement levels in real-world situations vary widely—Philadelphia, after all, replaced Don Money with Mike Schmidt, and Milwaukee replaced him with Sal Bando—since replacement levels vary widely, it is impossible to say exactly what the appropriate replacement level should be.

            I am using a system which, in essence, targets the replacement level at .250.   .250 is pretty low.   We shouldn’t ASSUME that the real-life replacement level is as low as .250, although sometimes it is; after all, there are whole teams of .250 players.   Zeile’s “marginal winning percentage”, above Money’s contributions, is .382.   I don’t know whether that’s a positive or a negative, but the system I have set up treats it as a positive, and I don’t have any strong feelings about it, so I will accept it as an advantage for Zeile.  Thus eliminating Money. 

 

Don Money—Won and Lost Contributions

YEAR

Team

Age

HR

RBI

AVG

SLG

OBA

OPS

BW

BL

FW

FL

Won

Lost

WPct

Value

1968

Phil

21

0

2

.231

.385

.333

.718

0

0

0

0

0

1

.262

0

1969

Phil

22

6

42

.229

.327

.296

.622

6

15

5

1

11

16

.396

8

1970

Phil

23

14

66

.295

.463

.361

.824

12

6

4

1

16

7

.690

21

1971

Phil

24

7

38

.223

.358

.276

.634

7

13

3

3

10

15

.393

7

1972

Phil

25

15

52

.222

.343

.278

.621

9

15

5

2

14

18

.439

12

1973

Mil

26

11

61

.284

.401

.347

.748

15

8

3

4

19

13

.590

21

1974

Mil

27

15

65

.283

.415

.346

.761

17

9

6

3

23

13

.642

28

1975

Mil

28

15

43

.277

.432

.331

.763

10

8

2

4

11

11

.500

11

1976

Mil

29

12

62

.267

.408

.333

.741

12

8

3

3

15

11

.579

17

1977

Mil

30

25

83

.279

.470

.348

.819

16

8

4

4

20

12

.635

25

1978

Mil

31

14

54

.293

.440

.361

.801

15

7

4

4

19

11

.635

23

1979

Mil

32

6

38

.237

.351

.316

.667

6

10

2

2

8

13

.387

6

1980

Mil

33

17

46

.256

.498

.348

.847

10

3

2

2

11

5

.677

14

1981

Mil

34

2

14

.216

.286

.288

.575

3

5

1

2

4

7

.365

3

1982

Mil

35

16

55

.284

.531

.360

.891

10

2

1

2

11

3

.756

14

1983

Mil

36

1

8

.149

.219

.220

.440

0

6

1

0

1

6

.131

0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

176

729

.261

.406

.328

.734

147

124

46

39

193

163

.543

209

 

 

Toby 69, Harlond 67 (OT)

            Toby Harrah overcame a 17-5 deficit in the “defense” category to defeat Harlond Clift in overtime, 69-67.

 

 

Harrah

Clift

Power

9

14

Speed

7

3

Hitting For Average

11

13

Plate Discipline

9

10

Career Length

14

7

Defense

5

17

Awards

6

0

Team Success

8

3

Total

69

67

 

            Harlond Clift was one of the wonder boys of early sabermetrics.  Naïve analysis—the evaluation of players that preceded organized research—leaned heavily on three points:  batting average, magic numbers, and playing for the glamour teams.   A “star” player, before sabermetrics, was basically anybody who hit .300 and played in the World Series a few times, and hit some magic numbers—2000 hits, 100 runs scored in a season, 200 hits, 20 homers.   Fielding was evaluated by visual reference, and by fielding percentage.   Fred Lindstrom.   High batting average, played in New York, played on championship teams, had 230 hits in a season twice, had good fielding percentages.   That’s a star.   Bobby Richardson.

            When sabermetrics developed and we began to ask basic questions like “Why do teams win?”, “What are the characteristics of winning teams?” and “How valuable is batting average, really?”, we developed our own ideas about who was good and who wasn’t.   Harlond Clift was, so to speak, the anti-Fred Lindstrom.   He played the same position as Lindstrom and sort of in the same era, a little later, but he had the opposite virtues:   He walked a lot and hit for power rather than hitting for average, his fielding percentages were ordinary but his range numbers extremely good.   In 1937 he had 405 assists and 50 double plays—both major league records at the time, both broken by Graig Nettles in 1971, but both still very near to the top of the all-time list.  But since he had played for terrible teams in small cities, basically nobody remembered him, and after about 1955 one could say that nobody had ever heard of him.

            He was, then “our” guy, our player—Clift and Dolph Camilli and Bob Allison and Roy Cullenbine and Maxie Bishop and Dick McAuliffe; these were the players who stepped forward from the caverns of history to claim the honors they had been unjustly denied while they played.   Of course, the story is always a little more complicated than that.   While Clift had had big numbers, he had done so in a league with very high ERAs and in hitters’ parks.   While his range numbers were extremely good, one has to remember that, on a team like the St. Louis Browns, there are a lot of balls in play.

            So many players have come and gone since then that the early heroes no longer seem quite as important.   We’ve had Mike Schmidt and Rickey Henderson and so many others, sabermetric-type players who WERE recognized in their own time.   But we have also moved the ball, since the mid-1970s, to where we are able to deal with these other issues better, and I would like to assert again:  Harlond Clift was a really good player.   We know now, courtesy of Retrosheet, that Harlond Clift in his career hit .272 at home, and .272 on the road, 88 homers at home, 90 on the road, .436 slugging at home, .442 on the road.   He did play in hitter’s parks, yes, but. . .it’s a 4 or 5% adjustment in some years, less in others.

            You’ll probably laugh at this argument, but it’s hard to believe how important it used to be.   If Bobby Richardson was “really” as bad a hitter as we said he was, the experts would demand to know, then why did the Yankees win?  If Harlond Clift was really as good as we said he was, why did he play for teams that lost a hundred games a year.  Didn’t the fact that Bobby Richardson played for good teams and Harlond Clift played for bad teams “prove” that Richardson was really a “winning” player?

            Well, think about it.   Harlond Clift in his best year (1937) had a won-lost contribution of 23-8, but his team finished 46-108.   46-108 is 138 Win Shares, 324 Loss Shares, a .299 winning percentage.   If you take Clift out of it, that just means that his teammates were 115-316, a .266 Winning Percentage.   There’s nothing really notable about that; all it means is that Clift had a lot of teammates who were not good.

            The fallacy of that argument, that the traditionalists used to make and probably still do if you don’t kick them once in awhile, is this:  that it pretends that they were making an effort to “consider” winning, that they were making an effort to force everything to add up the way it should, when it reality they (the traditionalists) were making absolutely no effort to understand how the pieces added up; it was only us who were doing that.   We were the ones who insisted that everything had to add up.

            Traded to Washington during World War II, Clift had a serious case of the mumps and an accident with a horse, limiting his contributions to the Senators’ pursuit of the pennant in 1945.   Well. . .maybe; that’s the company line.   In 1945 the Senators missed the American League pennant by one and a half games, while Clift hit just .211 with 8 homers and 53 RBI, far distant numbers from what he had done in St. Louis, where he had driven in 118 twice in a row.

            But look again.  The 1945 Washington Senators hit only one home run in their home park all season.   As a team.   They hit 27 homers that year, 26 on the road.   Their pitching staff gave up only 6 home runs at home (36 on the road).   You can’t really fault Clift for not hitting home runs in a place where there were no home runs.  With 76 walks for that season in 119 games, Clift’s won-lost contribution for that season is 14-10, despite the very poor triple crown stats.

            That’s actually very normal for a 32-year-old player of Clift’s skill. . .22-7 at age 25, 21-11 at age 29, 14-10 at age 32. . .it’s a normal progression.   It only looks abnormal because we’re contrasting what Clift did in a hitter’s park in a league that hit .281 (1937 and 1938) with what he later did in a very extreme pitcher’s park in a league that hit .255 (1945). 

            Well, you can’t hit .211 and hold your job. ..couldn’t then, anyway.   Probably still couldn’t.  Clift—who walked more often than any other player in this tournament—handed off the Washington third base job to a 19-year-old player who walked even more than he did:  Ed Yost.   I always wonder whether that is just a coincidence, or whether Clift, working with a young players as veterans often do, stressed to him the importance of getting on base any way he could.  And, while Clift walked more than any other third baseman in this study, it’s not a big advantage for him against Harrah, because Harrah also had five seasons with more than 90 walks, with a career high of 113.  

            Against Freddy Lindstrom; that’s another story.   We have Clift with an offensive won-lost contribution of 145-95 (.604); Lindstrom at 134-98 (.577).  We have Clift with a defensive won-lost contribution of 54-34 (.614); Lindstrom of 48-44 (.520).   Offense and defense together, that ‘s 199-129 for our guy, 182-142 for the one they put in Cooperstown.

Harlond Clift—Won and Lost Contributions

YEAR

Team

Age

HR

RBI

AVG

SLG

OBA

OPS

BW

BL

FW

FL

Won

Lost

WPct

Value

1934

StlA

21

14

56

.260

.421

.357

.778

12

13

4

5

16

18

.469

15

1935

StlA

22

11

69

.295

.436

.406

.842

11

8

4

3

15

11

.580

18

1936

StlA

23

20

73

.302

.514

.424

.938

15

8

5

4

20

12

.631

24

1937

StlA

24

29

118

.306

.546

.413

.960

17

6

6

2

23

8

.749

31

1938

StlA

25

34

118

.290

.554

.423

.977

17

5

5

2

22

7

.750

29

1939

StlA

26

15

84

.270

.411

.402

.813

12

9

3

4

16

14

.537

17

1940

StlA

27

20

87

.273

.463

.396

.859

13

9

6

2

19

11

.631

23

1941

StlA

28

17

84

.255

.430

.376

.806

15

10

6

3

20

14

.595

23

1942

StlA

29

7

55

.274

.399

.394

.794

15

7

6

3

21

11

.662

26

1943

StlA

30

3

25

.232

.301

.329

.630

7

10

6

1

12

11

.522

13

1943

Was

30

0

4

.300

.300

.417

.717

1

0

0

0

1

1

.539

1

1944

Was

31

0

3

.159

.227

.213

.440

0

2

0

1

0

3

.022

0

1945

Was

32

8

53

.211

.307

.349

.656

10

7

4

3

14

10

.589

16

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

178

829

.272

.390

.441

.831

145

95

54

34

199

129

.606

234

 

 

Buddy Bell 60, Mike Lowell 58 (OT)

            Buddy Bell overcame a 14-5 power disadvantage against Mike Lowell, defeating Mike Lowell 60-58 in overtime with a series of small advantages.

 

 

Bell

Lowell

Power

5

14

Speed

7

1

Hitting For Average

10

9

Plate Discipline

7

8

Career Length

10

5

Defense

11

8

Awards

9

7

Team Success

1

6

Total

60

58

 

            The Red Sox this season have two Brooks Robinson-model third basemen, Lowell and Adrian Beltre.    It is impossible to imagine two players who “scan” more similarly—that is, they do the same things well and have similar numbers—but who look and play more differently.   These two guys, if you watch them play, just have nothing in common in the way they approach the game.

            Mike Lowell had, I am quite certain, the best hands and wrists that I have ever seen on an athlete, and the highest level of confidence in his hands and wrists.    He played with an absolute economy of motion, other than in his hands.   He snared balls out of the air by slipping them into his glove, the rest of his body balanced and relaxed.   His ability to catch a line drive hit near him at third was extraordinary.   He fielded bad hops as if it was nothing; he could wait back on the big hop because he knew that he could react to it no matter whether it was a true hop or whether it wasn’t.   He could charge balls in front of him with immense confidence for the same reason; he didn’t need a true hop.   He could be charging a ground ball, get a bad hop, and unless you were watching closely you would never know it was a bad hop.   He made all the adjustments he needed to make between his elbows and his fingertips, quickly and automatically, moving nothing without need.

            He threw the same way, snapping off perfect throws effortlessly with his wrists, his feet at rest, his legs quiet, his torso hardly moving, his shoulders shifting a little, zinging the ball across the infield with no evidence of torque.   He hit the same way, with his feet at rest, his shoulders quiet, his waist and butt scarcely moving, generating stunning power with a quick motion that never seemed to get closer to his navel than his elbows.

            Beltre, of course, is the exact opposite; every muscle in his body is involved in every action.   Beltre hits with his whole body; he throws with his whole body.  Beltre’s swings pull him down to one knee; his throws are like javelin launches.   A line drive would simply disappear into Lowell’s glove; you were never quite sure he had it until he pulled it out and flipped it to the shortstop.    Beltre will knock the line drive down, wrestle it into submission, and gun it to first base.    Lowell played with fantastic efficiency; Beltre, although he is having as good a year as Lowell had in 2007 or better, seems to be trying to expend as much energy as possible on every play.    Beltre is super-intense; Lowell was super-calm.   Beltre plays with a perpetual urgency, a self-imposed desperation.  Lowell. . .I am not in any way suggesting he didn’t hustle. . .but Lowell played within himself, relaxed and easy.  Beltre chases a foul ball as if it was not only important for him to get there, but important for him to get there early.   Beltre is always on the very edge of being out of control; Lowell was just hanging out, letting the game come to him.

            Whether one of them is better than the other. . .well, it’s pretty close.   They came up at the same time, but Beltre is several years younger, so he probably will move ahead.  They are both true Brooks Robinson types, both .270-.280 hitters with medium-range power and good defense; Beltre, of course, is faster but not truly fast.   It just seems amazing to me that two players could be so totally different, and yet get results that are so much the same.  

 

 

Mike Lowell—Won and Lost Contributions

YEAR

Team

Age

HR

RBI

AVG

SLG

OBA

OPS

BW

BL

FW

FL

Won

Lost

WPct

Value

1998

NYA

24

0

0

.267

.267

.267

.533

0

0

0

0

0

1

.340

0

1999

Fla

25

12

47

.253

.419

.317

.736

6

8

2

2

8

9

.459

7

2000

Fla

26

22

91

.270

.474

.344

.818

13

9

3

2

16

11

.600

19

2001

Fla

27

18

100

.283

.448

.340

.789

13

10

4

2

17

12

.583

20

2002

Fla

28

24

92

.276

.471

.346

.816

16

10

3

3

19

13

.598

22

2003

Fla

29

32

105

.276

.530

.350

.881

15

6

4

2

19

8

.697

24

2004

Fla

30

27

85

.293

.505

.365

.870

18

7

4

2

22

9

.708

29

2005

Fla

31

8

58

.236

.360

.298

.658

8

15

3

3

12

18

.393

8

2006

Bos

32

20

80

.284

.475

.339

.814

12

12

5

1

17

13

.565

20

2007

Bos

33

21

120

.324

.501

.378

.879

15

10

5

1

20

11

.654

25

2008

Bos

34

17

73

.274

.461

.338

.798

9

9

4

1

13

10

.581

15

2009

Bos

35

17

75

.290

.474

.337

.811

9

10

3

1

12

12

.513

13

2009

Bos

36

4

22

.222

.335

.292

.627

2

6

1

1

3

7

.314

1

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

222

948

.278

.463

.341

.804

138

111

42

22

180

133

.575

203

 

 

            The chart below compares the 42 players who have now been eliminated from the tournament, and ranks them 1 through 42:

 

 

First

Last

BW

BL

B WPct

FW

FL

F WPct

Won

Lost

W Pct.

WS V

1

Ken

Boyer

189

124

.603

66

31

.681

255

155

.621

304

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2

Matt

Williams

165

135

.549

55

26

.675

220

162

.576

249

3

Harlond

Clift

145

95

.604

54

34

.614

199

129

.606

234

4

Heinie

Zimmerman

143

83

.633

54

44

.548

196

127

.608

231

5

Bill

Bradley

128

111

.536

69

41

.632

198

152

.566

221

6

Don

Money

147

124

.543

46

39

.543

193

163

.543

209

7

Troy

Glaus

144

93

.607

33

28

.533

176

122

.592

204

8

Mike

Lowell

138

111

.553

42

22

.659

180

133

.575

203

9

Freddy

Lindstrom

134

98

.577

48

44

.520

182

142

.561

202

10

Kevin

Seitzer

137

86

.615

35

29

.550

172

115

.601

201

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

11

Howard

Johnson

140

77

.645

27

40

.402

167

117

.588

192

12

Aramis

Ramirez

138

101

.577

30

28

.517

168

129

.565

187

13

Travis

Fryman

142

137

.510

39

32

.552

181

168

.518

187

14

Larry

Parrish

149

145

.508

34

48

.416

184

193

.487

179

15

Ray

Boone

119

77

.607

33

30

.524

153

108

.587

175

16

Doug

Rader

118

110

.517

45

29

.609

162

139

.539

174

17

Jeff

Cirillo

119

111

.518

39

17

.701

158

127

.554

173

18

Clete

Boyer

103

153

.402

66

15

.812

169

169

.501

170

19

Melvin

Mora

125

100

.555

29

24

.546

154

124

.553

169

20

Ken

McMullen

118

106

.526

39

29

.568

157

136

.536

167

21

Jerry

Denny

95

110

.461

62

38

.621

156

149

.511

160

22

Vinny

Castilla

120

176

.406

48

26

.643

168

202

.453

150

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

23

Hubie

Brooks

121

136

.471

37

41

.473

158

177

.471

148

24

Pinky

Whitney

106

136

.440

47

44

.519

154

180

.461

141

25

Phil

Nevin

109

70

.611

15

26

.372

124

95

.566

139

26

Bill

Melton

99

75

.569

28

27

.508

127

102

.555

139

27

Don

Hoak

91

99

.480

41

21

.664

132

119

.525

138

28

Joe

Randa

108

122

.470

32

25

.561

140

147

.488

137

29

Frank

Malzone

98

135

.420

44

24

.645

142

159

.471

133

30

Ray

Knight

100

111

.473

34

32

.517

134

143

.484

129

31

Brook

Jacoby

97

98

.498

30

30

.500

127

128

.498

127

32

David

Bell

88

125

.414

37

17

.683

126

143

.469

117

33

Charlie

Hayes

96

133

.419

35

26

.573

131

159

.452

117

34

Dean

Palmer

109

106

.508

16

37

.308

125

142

.468

117

35

Steve

Buechele

83

107

.435

36

19

.655

118

126

.484

115

36

Jim

Davenport

86

111

.437

35

26

.579

121

136

.471

114

37

Tony

Batista

85

115

.425

30

18

.632

115

133

.465

107

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

38

Luis

Salazar

75

103

.421

28

26

.514

103

130

.442

89

39

Bob

Aspromonte

77

115

.402

31

32

.495

108

146

.425

89

40

Tom

Brookens

65

110

.371

34

19

.642

99

129

.434

83

41

Ed

Sprague

75

106

.413

22

23

.484

96

129

.427

80

42

Ken

Reitz

70

138

.337

39

32

.549

110

171

.392

79

 

 

            As you can see, Ken Boyer is by far the best player eliminated from the tournament so far.   Boyer clears the first and second hurdles to be considered as a viable Hall of Famer.   No one else eliminated so far clears even the first.

 
 

COMMENTS (8 Comments, most recent shown first)

wovenstrap
Weskelton: It's not that hard to understand, in context. Bill gave a hypothetical in which a player had 10 more wins and 20 more losses than some other player. The "marginal winning percentage" there would be .333 -- in other words, he duplicated someone else's career exactly, but his excess performance was at a low level, the level of a losing team.

Bill is saying that the equivalent percentage for Zeile in this non-hypothetical scenario is similar -- to be precise, .382. If Zeile had contributed 8 extra wins and 13 extra losses (or any multiples of those), that would work out to about that. This is where the question of what the replacement level is comes in. If it's .400, then Zeile's "extra" games are actively adding losses to the average team. If it's .200, then those extra games are helping the average team.
3:32 AM Sep 25th
 
MarisFan61
re Harlond Clift: I LOVED those early articles about him, and he became one of my 'favorite' unappreciated players, as I guess he did for a lot of people. Even recognizing that maybe some of that was overdone, and also that some players we've had before our own eyes have been better than most people thought.....
I have to believe there's something wrong with what happened here if Toby Harrah beat Harlond Clift. If Clift wasn't better than Harrah, IMO those early articles were WAY overdone.

The upcoming match that I'm most looking forward to is Nettles-Keltner. I'm pretty sure I know how it'll come out but I'll love to see Bill's write-up.
4:59 PM Sep 24th
 
jdw
On the chart at the bottom, the group from Money to Seitzer is a fairly tight cluster from 201-209. Pitching Lindstrom, it's interestig that with Money the highest "ranked" by WS V that:

* He ranks last in B WPct
.615 Seitzer
.607 Glaus
.553 Lowell
.543 Money

* He ranks second to last in F WPct
.659 Lowell
.550 Seitzer
.543 Money
.533 Glaus

* He ranks last in W Pct.
.601 Seitzer
.592 Glaus
.575 Lowell
.543 Money

PA's are:
6062 Seitzer
6353 Glaus
6480 Lowell
6998 Money

Are 936 more PA's of Money worth more than a more efficeint Seitzer? Or is .601 vs .543 that significant given the 936 PA.

I take the chart to me that to Bill "it's very close". :)
3:57 PM Sep 24th
 
jdw
Bill: on the replacement level, is that .250 a fixed league wide number for all players/positions or does it vary by position to mirror the defensive spectrum and .250 is for 3B (.250 relative to other 3B in the game at that point)?
3:28 PM Sep 24th
 
weskelton
Still trying to figure out what this means...

"Zeile’s “marginal winning percentage”, above Money’s contributions, is .382."
1:33 PM Sep 24th
 
weskelton
Still trying to figure out what this means...

"Zeile’s “marginal winning percentage”, above Money’s contributions, is .382."
1:21 PM Sep 24th
 
jdw
Surprised Bando-Fryman and Bell-Lowell were that close. I'll be interested to see how close they are once Bando/Bell are elminated and the chart at the bottom of this article is re-run.

The OPS+ for Bando-Fryman isn't close, and Fryman having just two good quality seasons with the bat (1993 & 2000) in OPS+ (133 & 127) is reflected in OWS/OWLS (19-6 & 17-7). Bando went 153-135-137 from 1969-71 that tops that, then swamps it with 150, 130, 128 & 128 in 1973-74, 1976 & 1978. Not even short seasons there: only 1974 (146 games) was less than 152 games. Defense rates out as a minor Fryman advantage, which doesn't seem like enough to close up what one would have thought was a big offensive advantage for Bando. The relative team success (6-2) seems low considering how well the 1970-76 A's played... though "triple the success" is probably accurate. :)

Bando has been underrated and forgotten over the years, and typically does pretty well in your crunching. Being close to a .518 3B with a shorter career is very surprising. Looking at the old method of OWS+DWS:

230.1 + 52.4 - Bando
214.2 + 88.0 - Bell
211.1 + 70.2 - Boyer
153.0 + 61.2 - Clift
142.7 + 49.4 - Fryman

And the three of them that have run so far:

189-124 + 66-31 Boyer
145-95 + 54-34 Clift
142-137 + 39-32 Fryman

It's possible that you no longer have Bando ahead of Boyer (he was #11 in the NewHistAb to Boyer's #12). But I'd lay money that he's closer to Boyer than he is to Fryman. Makes me worry about Cey since he's very similar to Bando.

Don't take any of this as a negative comment. The pieces have all been very good, and the comments on the elminated players are fab.
10:59 AM Sep 24th
 
chill
Thanks.

The Beltre-Lowell essay is my favorite thing yet to come out of this series.

[Oh, and I just noticed this: Chipper Jones is a 2 seed?]
10:47 AM Sep 24th
 
 
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