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Brooks Robinson Tournament--Third Round Continues

September 27, 2010

 

September 28, 2010

            Brackets:

 

Baltimore Regional

Brooks Robinson (1) against

Jimmy Collins (5)

Tomorrow

Toby Harrah (3) has advanced

 

 

 

Cleveland Regional

Graig Nettles (1) has advanced

 

 

Ron Santo (2) against

Sal Bando (3)

Tomorrow

 

St. Louis Regional

Gary Gaetti (1) against

Scott Rolen (5)

Today

Chipper Jones (2) against

Todd Zeile (3)

September 30

 

Los Angeles Regional

Buddy Bell (1) against

Carney Lansford (4) 

Today

Tim Wallach (2) against

Ron Cey (3)

September 30

 

 

 

BUDDY BELL 59, LANSFORD 55

 

            Buddy Bell used a 16-3 advantage in defense to escape defeat in a game that would otherwise have belonged to Carney Lansford.

 

 

Bell

Lansford

Power

11

10

Speed

2

6

Hitting For Average

8

12

Plate Discipline

9

8

Career Length

9

7

Defense

16

3

Awards

3

1

Team Success

1

8

Total

59

55

 

 

            Bell and Lansford, contemporary players, were almost even in career on-base percentage (.341, .343) and slugging percentage (.406, .411), giving them almost the same OPS.    This was reflected in an evenly played contest in which Bell led early 11-10, then trailed 43-39 through five frames.   But Bell’s Gold Glove defense, combined with Lansford’s extremely limited range, gave Bell a huge advantage in the defensive comparison, putting him ahead 55-46 too late in the game for Lansford to rally.

            Lansford’s defense is something that we have talked a lot about, and I don’t want to go over that stuff again.   Lansford had a long career—14 years as a regular—and, in his good years, his offense was more than enough to compensate for his bad defensive habits.

 

Carney Lansford—Career Won and Lost Contributions

YEAR

Team

Age

HR

RBI

AVG

SLG

OBA

OPS

BW

BL

FW

FL

Won

Lost

WPct

Value

1978

Cal

21

8

52

.294

.406

.339

.746

12

7

2

4

14

11

.556

15

1979

Cal

22

19

79

.287

.436

.329

.764

16

12

4

5

20

17

.540

21

1980

Cal

23

15

80

.261

.390

.312

.703

13

14

2

6

15

20

.434

13

1981

Bos

24

4

52

.336

.439

.389

.828

12

3

2

2

15

5

.734

20

1982

Bos

25

11

63

.301

.444

.359

.803

12

9

3

3

14

12

.549

16

1983

Oak

26

10

45

.308

.475

.357

.832

8

4

2

2

11

6

.644

13

1984

Oak

27

14

74

.300

.439

.342

.781

18

7

4

3

22

11

.673

27

1985

Oak

28

13

46

.277

.429

.311

.740

9

8

0

4

10

12

.448

8

1986

Oak

29

19

72

.284

.421

.332

.753

15

11

2

4

17

14

.540

18

1987

Oak

30

19

76

.289

.455

.366

.821

17

6

4

2

21

9

.700

26

1988

Oak

31

7

57

.279

.360

.327

.687

12

12

4

3

16

15

.530

17

1989

Oak

32

2

52

.336

.405

.398

.803

17

6

4

3

21

9

.690

27

1990

Oak

33

3

50

.268

.320

.333

.652

11

11

4

3

15

14

.517

16

1991

Oak

34

0

1

.063

.063

.063

.125

0

1

0

0

0

1

.000

0

1992

Oak

35

7

75

.262

.369

.325

.694

11

11

3

4

14

15

.476

13

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

151

874

.290

.411

.343

.754

183

123

41

48

224

171

.566

250

 

 

 

 

ROLLIN’, ROLEN, ROLLIN’

 

            Scott Rolen used big advantages in plate discipline and hitting for average to drive to an easy victory over #1 seed Gary Gaetti.    Gaetti becomes the first #1 seed to be eliminated from the tournament. 

 

 

 

Rolen

Gaetti

Power

13

14

Speed

6

4

Hitting For Average

19

6

Plate Discipline

15

5

Career Length

8

14

Defense

13

14

Awards

3

3

Team Success

6

5

Total

83

65

 

 

            Rolen earlier defeated Ken Boyer by four points—and, in truth, Boyer would have defeated Gaetti almost as easily as did Rolen.   While Gaetti had a 20-year major league career and did have his points as a player, he was in reality sort of the Danny Darwin of third baseman—a player who had as many bad years as good ones, and just as bad.    Gaetti was very strong.   He had excellent power, an accurate arm, and was mechanically outstanding at third base—excellent positioning, balance, reactions, form.   He didn’t make mistakes.  He was also slow, a .250 hitter, and he didn’t walk.   He played in a relatively high-run context (19th highest among the 66 players.)  He never had an MVP-type season, and, at least when he was with Kansas City, he was a lousy teammate.

            A .308 on-base percentage, for a hitter, is like a 4.50 ERA for a pitcher, a 38% field goal percentage for a basketball player, a felony conviction for a financial adviser or bad breath for a blind date:  you almost don’t need to ask what the rest of the information is.

 

 

Gary Gaetti—Career Won and Lost Contributions

YEAR

Team

Age

HR

RBI

AVG

SLG

OBA

OPS

BW

BL

FW

FL

Won

Lost

WPct

Value

1981

Minn

22

2

3

.192

.423

.192

.615

0

1

0

0

1

1

.387

0

1982

Minn

23

25

84

.230

.443

.280

.723

9

15

3

3

12

18

.408

9

1983

Minn

24

21

78

.245

.414

.309

.724

11

15

5

2

16

17

.481

15

1984

Minn

25

5

65

.262

.350

.315

.665

10

15

8

1

18

16

.534

19

1985

Minn

26

20

63

.246

.409

.301

.710

10

15

6

2

15

17

.473

15

1986

Minn

27

34

108

.287

.518

.347

.865

14

11

6

1

20

13

.615

24

1987

Minn

28

31

109

.257

.485

.303

.788

12

15

3

3

15

17

.463

14

1988

Minn

29

28

88

.301

.551

.353

.905

15

5

4

2

19

6

.752

26

1989

Minn

30

19

75

.251

.404

.286

.690

9

14

5

1

14

15

.488

14

1990

Minn

31

16

85

.229

.376

.274

.650

8

19

6

2

14

21

.399

10

1991

Cal

32

18

66

.246

.379

.293

.672

11

15

5

3

16

18

.462

14

1992

Cal

33

12

48

.226

.342

.267

.610

6

15

4

2

9

17

.362

6

1993

Cal

34

0

4

.180

.220

.250

.470

0

2

0

0

0

3

.058

0

1993

KC

34

14

46

.256

.477

.309

.786

6

6

4

0

10

7

.595

11

1994

KC

35

12

57

.287

.462

.328

.789

6

8

4

0

10

8

.555

11

1995

KC

36

35

96

.261

.518

.329

.846

13

9

3

3

16

12

.575

18

1996

StL

37

23

80

.274

.473

.326

.799

12

10

3

2

16

13

.554

17

1997

StL

38

17

69

.251

.404

.305

.710

8

14

5

2

13

16

.454

12

1998

StL

39

11

43

.265

.454

.339

.793

7

6

2

1

9

8

.542

10

1998

Cubs

39

8

27

.320

.594

.397

.991

5

0

1

0

6

0

.952

9

1999

Cubs

40

9

46

.204

.339

.260

.599

2

11

2

1

4

12

.261

0

2000

Bos

41

0

1

.000

.000

.000

.000

0

1

0

0

0

1

.000

0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

360

1341

.255

.434

.308

.741

174

223

79

31

253

254

.499

253

 

 

 

 

Run Context for Each Player

 

 

            The chart below gives the offensive context in which each player performed.   We start with the league average of runs per game, and modify that by the appropriate park adjustment factor.   This total (PARG, or Park-Adjusted Runs Per Game) we multiply by the player’s plate appearances for each season, and divide the total by career plate appearances.    The player in the tournament who performed in the highest-run environment was Billy Nash; in the lowest-run context, Ken McMullen.

Rank

Player

Runs Per Game

Runs Per 162 Games

1

Billy Nash

6.198

1004

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2

Jerry Denny

5.448

883

3

Vinny Castilla

5.408

876

 

 

 

 

4

Jeff Cirillo

5.203

843

5

Jimmie Dykes

5.195

842

6

Harlond Clift

5.157

835

7

Joe Randa

5.153

835

8

Pinky Whitney

5.121

830

9

Travis Fryman

5.007

811

10

Ed Sprague

5.004

811

 

 

 

 

11

Willie Kamm

4.997

810

12

Dean Palmer

4.980

807

13

Jimmy Collins

4.958

803

14

Tony Batista

4.869

789

15

Troy Glaus

4.853

786

16

Melvin Mora

4.831

783

17

Aramis Ramirez

4.761

771

 

 

 

 

18

David Bell

4.743

768

19

Gary Gaetti

4.715

764

20

Kevin Seitzer

4.708

763

21

Mike Lowell

4.686

759

22

Freddie Lindstrom

4.672

757

23

Chipper Jones

4.623

749

24

Scott Rolen

4.616

748

25

Adrian Beltre

4.568

740

26

Todd Zeile

4.560

739

27

Brook Jacoby

4.546

736

28

Frank Malzone

4.538

735

29

Charlie Hayes

4.537

735

30

Edgardo Alfonzo

4.532

734

31

Phil Nevin

4.528

734

 

 

 

 

32

Tom Brookens

4.474

725

33

Don Hoak

4.473

725

34

Steve Buechele

4.442

720

35

Matt Williams

4.438

719

36

Ken Boyer

4.431

718

37

Ron Santo

4.390

711

38

Willie Jones

4.364

707

39

Larry Parrish

4.355

706

40

Toby Harrah

4.327

701

41

Ken Keltner

4.322

700

42

Ray Boone

4.321

700

43

Bob Elliott

4.310

698

44

Doug DeCinces

4.304

697

45

Carney Lansford

4.284

694

46

Buddy Bell

4.269

692

47

Harry Steinfeldt

4.254

689

 

 

 

 

48

Bill Melton

4.210

682

49

Graig Nettles

4.196

680

50

Don Money

4.188

678

51

Hubie Brooks

4.152

673

52

Ken Reitz

4.151

672

53

Tim Wallach

4.113

666

54

Howard Johnson

4.099

664

55

Luis Salazar

4.091

663

56

Ron Cey

4.086

662

57

Clete Boyer

4.076

660

58

Ray Knight

4.063

658

59

Jim Davenport

4.046

655

 

 

 

 

60

Bill Bradley

3.993

647

61

Doug Rader

3.962

642

62

Brooks Robinson

3.922

635

63

Sal Bando

3.895

631

64

Heinie Zimmerman

3.855

625

65

Bob Aspromonte

3.828

620

 

 

 

 

66

Ken McMullen

3.697

599

 
 

COMMENTS (6 Comments, most recent shown first)

kcale
Yes, overrated in the sense that he's generally perceived as "God-like" defensively. When Bill finally rates all the players in this tournament my guess is his defensive winning % will be near the top but not way above everyone else. And his career OPS+ is only 104... not exactly tearing it up at the plate. His high career value is driven more by his career length than by his quality of play (although he was still a great defensive player).
8:51 AM Sep 29th
 
MarisFan61
KC: re BrooksR being "overrated":

I'm not sure if you mean he wasn't as great on defense as most people think, or....
Third base defense isn't as important as most people think.

I think 3B defense is more important than the credit it's being given here, and if we were (let's say) choosing up sides to play an actual game, I'd have to think for a second or two before picking Schmidt over Brooks.

I mean, don't worry, I'd pick Schmidt, but I'd have to think for a sec. :-)
As long as our metrics fail to take into account how good defense helps 'save' a pitching staff, I think we always have to fudge its importance upwards from whatever our calculations might show.
10:12 PM Sep 28th
 
kcale
I picked Toby in the Bal region as a dark horse. I don't think Bill will rate Toby over Brooks but once you get past career value, I think Brooks is a very overrated player.
Go Toby!


6:20 PM Sep 28th
 
jdw
A little surprised looking back at the predictions in the first post by how many picked someone other than Brooks winning the BAL Region, especially how many picked Matt Williams. There was at least one Toby pick, a number of Clift picks. Didn't see anyone picking Dykes.

Cey, Chipper and Santo were overwhelming picks, especially Chipper. Some Nettles as an alternative to Santo.

Most seemed to have Chipper going all the way.
4:04 PM Sep 28th
 
jdw
I have a feeling that Buddy-Carney is one of those that won't be be as close in WSV as it looks to people above from the "Game Score". 2100+ more PA's for Buddy with a tight OPS+ (109 vs 111) that gets wiped out by Buddy's defense (and Carney's lack of it).

Still, Carney finishing in pretty much a dead heat with Matt Williams is pretty interesting. Probably should have guessed that as their OPS+ are pretty spot on, PAs aren't too far off, and Carney's small advantage there gets washed by the defense. The drastic BA Hitter vs Power Hitter constrast makes one think of them as very different offensive contributions.

What's interesting about Gaetti is just how few "good" seasons there are in that long career. 1986 & 1988. He was a starter from 1982-1998/99. I don't think he had many fans among statheads back while active, and that numbers above aren't likely to win him many. An argument might be made that a .500 range 3B has value to a team, and certainly is above the replacement level. But Gary was pretty well paid from 1988 through the mid-90s. That tends to eat into the "value" of a .500 3B, especially when he was under .500 for most of 1989-93.

Bill: who would you have advanced if they went head-to-head? Gary has a very slight WSV, but it's really PA driven while Carney has a clear W% advantage and a big gap in the number of years he was .500+.
1:29 PM Sep 28th
 
MarisFan61
An advantage of keeping late hours is that you often get to make the first reply, isn't it....

I don't think anyone who has read Bill's laugh-out-loud descriptions of Lansford's defense over the years is surprised that he didn't advance further. But just judging from what we heard from announcers and saw superficially, we would have been shocked.

OK Bill, sorry, I can't resist. :-)
From the Historical Baseball Abstract:
"....His range was however far he could dive; not a step and a dive, just a dive...."
12:56 AM Sep 28th
 
 
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